Ball Games at Hamlet Avenue

Gigman

New Member
Hi All,
I'm living on Hamlet Avenue a year now and cannot get over the amount of teenagers kicking a ball very hard indeed into peoples properties and gardens. Our household has been hit many times. We have contacted the management company who are unhelpful and basically useless. Worse we knocked at the childrens parents house and basically told to **** **f. Parental intelligence lacking is not the sentence.

When we say, ball games we mean kicking a ball hard at full belt at all hours, starting at 10am with luck finishing 10.45pm. Some of the children also tell you its none of your business.One actaully spitted at us.

Does a resident association exist in Chieftains way and what action should be taken to stop this behaviour. It states in the estate rules no ball games in common areas within the dvelopement. I presume it includes the road way. Is it being enforced by the management company?

We understand children need to play but ball games hitting off the front of your property and car is surely not on. Can anybody provide some guidance on this matter?

Gigman
 

Meils

New Member
Hi,
I live on the other side of the estate, near the green and still we have kids playing out on the road. My concern is more that the children are quite young and I think its dangerous for them to be running around and cycling their bikes in the middle of the road, especially when there is a green a stones throw away.

Anyway, in answer to your questions - yes the management company are pretty useless when it comes to everything to do with the estate, except asking for their money each year. There is a residents association and you can contact them through the Chieftains Way website http://chieftainsway.tripod.com/index.html. They don't have meetings for the whole estate very often but they probably meet as a committee more or may even be able to give you some advice.

At the end of the day I think it comes down to the children and parents having common sense and respect for other people. If you are constantly being haressed by them you may need to bring it further, especially if you are having no joy with the parents. I know that Fingal County Council aren't responsible for most things in the estate but it might be no harm to contact them or even to check out their website, they might even have advice about dealing with anti-social behaviour.

Sorry I can't be much help.
 

laurent

New Member
Hi,

It's not an easy thing to answer

1. there is an association (I am one of them I deal mostly with our mail and web activities ) Meil gave you our website address and we have a mail there.

There is little the association can do for you in this case.

Sounds like it's a case of having to talk to the parents again and if this fails then maybe a call to the Garda would be in order, ASBO anyone. I'd like to know where in the estate this happening as it might be worth a call to SPM to find out exactly where kids are supposed to play according to their "common area" rules.

Also Hamlet avenue is between the baron's hall and Chieftain's way estates SPM also responsible for both estate I am not sure were responsibility would lie.

The rules of the estate are just about worth the paper they are written on. You probably broke them yourself like 99% of residents by installing a TV aerial or satellite dish (as cable was not available until very recently if at all).
 

Gigman

New Member
Ball Games

All thank you for the comments,

Yesterday, we had ball games played at 3.15pm till 11pm. Eleven children, ranging from ages, early teens and as young as five years old, kicked a ball at a local estate agent sign for target practice.

Due to our household not with good sound proofing, we could hear every bang and bump of the ball played. The ball was kicked against cars, people’s properties, in gardens, off railings and off bins. The behaviour was pretty foul yesterday which is driving us crazy. We now have inputted cameras, should any person damage our household we know which door to knock on.

Today the games continue after approaching the resident’s parents who basically do not care, by saying don’t speak English. To make it worse, one off the adults who is Irish joined in the fun. I was told again they can do what ever they want. So much for good parenting!


I researched further to the problem of ball games. The county council who were very helpful by the way stated: this behaviour would not be tolerated in any council estate. Unfortunately, due to the estate not taken in charge we are very much on our own to make the rules.

After contacting a Garda who said: ASBO’s would be quite difficult to issue as no criminal damage is done. It would be a civil matter.


As the management company is useless, the Gardai and management company and county council being powerless, I do not know what other route can be taken only moving out of the estate. There seems to be just a lack of respect for all property and area.


My solicitor tells me should the children fall or has an accident playing ball games an insurance company would not pay out due to it mentioned in the estate rules which are included in the contract when signing for the house and lease.

I'm just wondering why we are the only one complaining of this behaviour and why other residents on Hamlet Avenue do not complain about the situation. It only compounds the truth they are afraid to say anything.

Don’t get me wrong, we never want to spoil children playing. We have children ourselves who respect other people’s property and space. Above all, never allowed play on the street in front of property.

Can I suggest the next residents meeting highlight this problem and inform the estate this behaviour is no longer tolerated?
 

jordy

New Member
Ball Games in the Street Chieftians Lane and Hamlet Avenue

Hello everone.i do sympathise about what you wrote regarding children playing football in the street,we are suffering from this to,if you want to put a stop to this contact the Private Residential Tenancies Board (www.prtb.ie)
and go into the Information on Third Party Applications for PRTB Dispute Resolution and download the form,if the children are from houses that are privately rented the you defenitly have a case against the landlord who is ultimaley responsible for his tennants(You also may be entitled to compensation from the landlord) I got the management company to send a letter to the occupants of the house advising them they could not play football in the street,also complain to the management company ever time they play football in the street and keep a log of the times and dates etc. and most importantly take photographs as you will need this information as evidence,do not give up and be patient.One night not so long ago about 20 children were playing football in the street banging the football against residents cars house windows damaging plants,not one of the neighbours complained, at one point they were using a car for a goalpost the people were in their house but they did nothing and said nothing.We approached the adults of the house to complain to them they said they could do what they wanted and until more people complain the situation will only worsen remember you may want to sell your house one day can you imagine a buyer driving up the street and witnessing 20-30 children playing in the street.I have driven up Hamlet ave many times and witnessed this myself nearly knocking down one of the children not to mention the mess the make.I must make the point complain keep a log and take photos,these landlords must start taking responsibilty for their tennants and uder Irish Law we are protected i have listed a few of the acts that refer to tenants B]Under Section 15 (1) of the Residential Tenancies Act 2004
Landlords can be ordered to make substantial payments to affected parties for the distress caused by their failure to enforce thier tenants obligations.
Tenants obligations under section 16 of the Tenancies Act 2004
Environmental Protection Agency Act 1992 section 108 (3)
 

jordy

New Member
Complain about nuisance neighbours.

If you are having problems with neighbours from rented accomadation contact
(www.prtb.ie)


Information Note

Third Party Applications for PRTB Dispute Resolution

Introduction
Under Section 15(1) of the Residential Tenancies 2004, a landlord of a rental dwelling owes to each person, who could be potentially affected (e.g. by anti-social behaviour), a duty to enforce the obligations of the tenant under the tenancy. In cases where a landlord fails to enforce a tenant’s obligation under Section 16 of the Act, a directly and adversely affected individual may take a case against the landlord through the Private Residential Tenancies Board (PRTB). The case will be heard by an independent PRTB adjudicator, who can direct the landlord to enforce their tenants’ obligations. Landlords can also be ordered to make substantial payments to affected parties for the distress caused by their failure to enforce their tenants’ obligations. Please note that third party issues in relation to the standard and maintenance of a rental dwelling are a matter for local authority enforcement and the PRTB does not have jurisdiction to deal with such complaints. It should also be noted that in order to provide a fair and neutral service to all parties, the PRTB cannot provide legal advice or specific guidance to either party in relation to their dispute.

Initial Steps
The affected individual must first attempt to resolve the matter directly with the landlord and may be required to verify this if they subsequently make a formal PRTB dispute application. If the affected party is unable to identify or contact the landlord, they can make a formal request for the landlord’s and/or letting agent’s (where applicable) name and address (if registered) from the PRTB under Section 77(3) of the Act. The attached application form must be fully completed and submitted by post to obtain this contact information (e-mail or telephone requests are not accepted). If the rental property in question is not registered, the PRTB may take enforcement action against the landlord in question.

Formal application for PRTB dispute resolution
If the initial attempt to satisfactorily resolve the matter directly with the landlord or his/her agent fail, the affected individual may make an application for dispute resolution to the PRTB. In accordance with the Act, this application can only be made by the affected individual and not by a representative or a residents’ committee. A copy of the Dispute Application form is available on www.prtb.ie and there is a €25 application fee. The applicant should enclose relevant documentary evidence in support of their case e.g. log of events, photographs, witness statements or Garda reports (where applicable). The applicant must also submit evidence that they informed the landlord of the alleged breach of the tenants’ obligations.


The Dispute application form (including the applicant’s name but not address) and all supporting documentary evidence will be copied in full to the landlord and tenant(s), who will also be invited to attend the Dispute Resolution Hearing. The PRTB adjudicator can only consider documentation circulated to all parties. The applicant may send a representative to the PRTB hearing in their place, or alternatively submit a written statement in their absence for circulation to the parties at the hearing, so long as the PRTB is notified sufficiently in advance. PRTB adjudication proceedings and the subsequent adjudicator’s report are confidential to the parties. However, the subsequent Determination Order in the case will be published on the PRTB’s website and will list the names of the case parties and the rental property address.

Outcome of Dispute hearing
At the hearing, all parties will be given the opportunity to set out their side of the case using documentary evidence already circulated, if necessary. If an agreement is not reached at the PRTB dispute hearing, the adjudicator will make a determination in relation to the case, which will be sent to all parties, as part of the adjudicator’s report after the hearing. If the adjudicator’s report is not appealed to a PRTB Tribunal, the Board of the PRTB will make a Determination Order, which is legally binding and can be enforced in the courts by the PRTB, if necessary, if it is not complied with by relevant party. This can result in a criminal conviction.

Appeal of Dispute hearing
The applicant or the landlord may appeal an adjudicator’s report within 21 days of the adjudicator’s report issuing to the parties. An appeal will be considered by a three person PRTB hearing and its proceeding are open to the public. Tribunal reports are published on the PRTB’s website. The Tribunal’s report will form the basis of a Determination Order, which will subsequently be made by the Board of the PRTB
 

DB2021

New Member
I live in a nearby estate in Balbriggan and we're experiencing this issue too. The estate consists of (mainly) privately owned houses. Children in the estate are outside all day everyday kicking their footballs off of people's cars, houses and windows. It has become a problem that many residents are frustrated by. These children are also in an out of people's property on their bikes and scooters. Parents have been approached but they have a deluded, self entitled attitude of; "our kids will do what they want". What a fantastic way to prepare these kids for the real world!

We asked a child to keep his football out of our garden after he kicked it off of one of our cars a couple of months back. He left our garden unphased and continued to play with the football, back up towards his own house. His father, having heard us ask his son to keep the ball out of our garden; stopped his child in the road and instructed him to come back down to our house and kick his football back into our garden....? Honestly....what kind of parenting is that. The child refused and the father continued to push him, physically walking him back down towards our house. The child continued to refuse to do it so eventually, the father became frustrated and kicked the football out of his son's hands, causing his son to run back up to his house crying. This descended into an argument, with both parents trying to blame US for making the child cry!! We were in no way, shape or form responsible for this. I would imagine that the father was trying to avoid an earful from his wife by trying to blame us. Unluckily for him though, we have the entire account on CCTV.

It's very simple; if your child enters someone else's property, and the owner of that property has explicitly stated that the child is not permitted on the property; if they continue to enter the property after this point, this is trespassing. In the eyes of the law, parents are liable in these instances. The excuse of "they're just kids" isn't good enough. If they're "too young" to comprehend this instruction; they are too young to be playing outside unsupervised. If they are being properly supervised while playing outside - then it shouldn't be happening. It is the parents responsibility to ensure that their child is not getting into trouble and doing things that they shouldn't be doing. The parents certainly should not be encouraging this kind of behaviour!!!

EVERYONE has the right to enjoy their home and estate. Most estates have large green areas for children to play in. These areas are usually far enough away from houses that children can play football without being a nuisance to the rest of the estate. The children still get to play uninterrupted and people's property is spared from potential damage - everyone wins. If you are refusing to implement preventative measures with your child and consequently, actively preventing people from being able to enjoy their home by allowing your children to "do what they want" - you're a selfish a**hole, plain and simple.
 
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