58 Apts sold... to NAMA/Cluid in Beacon South Quarter

aoifa

New Member
http://www.98fm.com/2011/category-news-sport/nama-properties-bought-for-reduced-rental-scheme/


The Housing Minister’s unveiled a new social housing scheme in Sandyford in Dublin saying the project is a huge departure for Ireland and a fresh, new approach to social housing.

It brings welcome relief for people on the housing list looking urgently for accomodation.

Housing Association Clúid bought 58 apartments in the Beacon South Quarter from NAMA and 34 of these will go to people on the local authority list for reduced rents, while the rest will be privately rented.

Speaking to 98FM News, Minister Willie Penrose says he’s working with NAMA to see if they can create similar projects around the country.

Housing associations are independent non-profit making groups that provide rented housing for people who cannot afford to buy their own homes or special groups, such as older people or homeless people.
 

MayBaby2011

New Member
this really upsets me. Will never be able to rent my "half million euro" apt or sell it EVER. So depressing. Feel totally trapped.

anyone else have any thoughts??
 

killanigia

New Member
likewise, couldn't sleep last night worrying about that. Definitely merits discussion at a residents committee meeting which are due to re-start in august....? in meantime, suggest contacting simon coyle in mazars or john morton to get some info on the development. we need some level of commitment to the quality of the development - otherwise, throwing back the keys may become an option for some. :(
 

MayBaby2011

New Member
thanks for replying killanigia. I emailed John Morton last night, no response yet.

My boyfriend actually rang Cluid housing association and they said they would be willing to address concerned residents.....we suggested that maybe they could speak at the social night out (no pun intended!) that has been advertised in the lifts...next weekend...in the beacon hotel. Perhaps this is not the best time? When/where are the residents committee meetings? could we invite them to that?

is this where residents post most? I thought there was another forum but couldn't find it...
 

killanigia

New Member
hi maybaby,
I emailed Simon in Mazars this morning and am happy to let you know what I find out (PM me). You may have questions yourself which you would like to address with him directly.
Clare does a great job on behalf of the residents and running the original BSQ forum but residents committees were suspended late last year I think. She has told me recently that they were hoping to re-start meetings later in August. I expect this development will ensure this happens and it will be agenda item #1. I think it would be good to have housing agency at it too. I've suggested to Clare that the residents / management company should establish a line of communication with the housing agency before process starts. I think we all need to ensure the project works, risks are managed and is limited in current and future scale to be effective. Existing homeowners' concerns and long term value of their investments (which were made at the peak of the boom) need to be recognised by the other stakeholders (Nama, receivers, management company etc.). This includes what happens to the incomplete blocks, liability of management fees, maintenance of common areas etc.

But I am sure it will be a hot topic at the "social" evening next week too though.
 

aoifa

New Member
I think it would be a great idea if someone from either Cluid or Mazars would be available to give an update to the residents committee that could then be passed on to everyone. The update from Mazars is essential at this point and should encompass the entire development, not just the new element of Cluid.

Our AGM is also overdue... only by about 8 months! At this stage I don't think the lack of communication from our management office is a good sign. The only 'update' we have been given is the info that came with our management fee notices eight months ago. The silence is quite worrying and also, I think, disrespectful.

To be honest, before Cluid bought those apts from NAMA we weren't going to get anywhere near what we paid for the apts, this just rams home the fact. You may still get a reasonable rental amount if you are realistic about what is achievable in the current market and location and your block is well maintained.
 

killanigia

New Member
@purplegirl. 100% - no AGM, communication I received from Mazars was non-committal. I would urge others to push Mazars for more information too. Given the prices we paid for our apartments (and loss made already), I don't think it's too much to request some commitments from the receivers, Cluid and management company at this stage. How many owners are getting to the point of handing back keys to banks ....:confused:
 

2can

New Member
Hi,

I am a postgraduate planning student and I am currently writing my dissertation on the Social Housing Leasing Initiative. Would I be able to attend this meeting?
 

aoifa

New Member
Personally I do not think it would be acceptable for you, or anyone who is not a management fee payer, to attend. We are looking for an update on a wide range of issues and not just the social housing aspect.
 

2can

New Member
I understand entirely. Thank you. Is there a residence committee member with whom I may speak with in relation to Social Housing Leasing Initiative?
 

Tadgh1980

New Member
Hi all,

Do you know when the next residents meeting is due to be sheduled. Cluid have been in touch with John Morton and are planning on attending (I have emailed confirmation of this) and perhaps Mazars can be invited too?
 

myusername

New Member
Dear Residents,

The people of Castleforbes Square D1 feel your pain, we fear the same could happen to us, we should all unite and plan a General Mortgage Default, only then they will listen to us, RTE is currently trying to make a documentary on people like us, the forgotten of society, check our neighbourhood for more details.
 

killanigia

New Member
i do think there is merit in mobilising the owners of beacon who bought in at peak and look to the banks for some form of debt forgiveness - call it what you like. If Cluid are able to buy a host of apartments at rock bottom prices, funding it through a loan from a State funded agency, surely ordinary homeowners are entitled to some form of rebate. Quid pro quo. 500+ ordinary homeowners can be a strong voice, if mobilised well. Keen to put this on an agenda for discussion too.
 

myusername

New Member
Hi Killanigia, that's exactly my point.

Given the scale of this recession, all the bailouts, and the latest NAMA move, we are definitely being laughed at, my proposal is for Interest Forgiveness, in other words, to be allowed to pay exactly what we owe, whithout any interest, otherwise we should all consider a strategic default.

We don't want to run away from our debts, we should pay for our own mistakes, but why should we be forced to pay for the banks mistakes?

They overvalued our homes, therefore they made a mistake as well, and should share the burden, either way, they will still get all their money back, what they can't expect is to profit (interest) from their mistakes, they should consider themselves lucky to be repayed in full interest free.

If more Neighbourhoods join forces on this we may achieve something otherwise we will pay up to 1million for homes and nobody will care less.
 

BSQ2011

New Member
Purplegirl - you do not want to help out a postgrad student but yet expect the rest of the country to help you out of the property hole you have gotten yourself into. That person should be able to attend the meeting for educational reasons - it is hardly top secret information. Shame on you!

Myusername - bankers did not overvalue houses, your greed along with everyone else overvalued these apts, yes the bankers are to blame for most of the problems but they did not tie you up and force you to take out a mortgage for an apt in the middle of what is effectively nowhere. You made the decisions and you have to stand by them. If the apt prices had doubled you would clap yourself on the back at the wise decision. Now that things have gone the opposite to what you had planned, well you look for someone to blame and get a piece of the bailout pie. I have rented here for 3 yrs, I would have bought but the key difference is I realised I couldn't afford it. Provided you don't lose your job or your partner doesn't lose their job, then there shouldn't be a problem for you it just means you won't be able to trade up like you had planned. This applies to everyone else who uses this stream to moan and blame others for a gamble taken that didn't pay off. All my money is down the drain but I am not complaining.

No doubt I will be banned from this site for speaking my mind....
 

myusername

New Member
BSQ2011, people like you will always rent and will never buy anyway, if you want to rent forever go ahead but you have now the option to buy property from NAMA at a 70% discount with a full guarantee against negative equity, at the expense of my taxes, so What more do you Want???

I am not sorry for you, you were wise and have benefited from the recession, therefore you will be able to buy cheaply, that's your reward, you should be really happy!

Do you not feel some degree of sympathy for people who will end up paying 1million for an apartment which is now worth 145K, when there are now people who will avail of the same apartments for life and for free?

Anyway, if NAMA want to distort the normal rules of the market, then nobody will force me to pay 1 million for something that is worth 145K.

For the price of my mortgage, i can now rent somewhere else for 800, and still save 850 per month. In just 15 years i will have saved 153K, enough to buy an apt in cash!!! Total cost 279K, plus my loss so far of 100K= 379K

On the other hand, if i keep paying my mortgage, i will end up paying nearly 1million for my apt and will only own it in 30 years, so what would you do? it's a no brainer.

I'm sure that you would prefer the banks to just forgive the interest portion of our debt, to a General Strategic Default on 115 Billion worth of residencial mortgage debt, with much wider consequences, where all of your taxes would have to go to the banks again, worsening the recession, therefore forcing you perhaps to emigrate?

We still want to pay the 115 Billion that we owe, what we don't want is to pay interest on that and allow the banks to profit from their mistakes.

PS- Is the Centre of a Capital the middle of nowhere???
 

Arthur

Member
Excellent post Myusername.

You have hit the nail right on the head.

Whilst the banks and the government appear to be in the early stages of formulating some sort of debt right off for mortgage holders in negative equity. They are indicating that any scheme will only be applied in a case by case basis and only to those who can prove that they cant pay.

Once again the poor sods who are going out to work every day and paying their taxes are being expected to carry the full burden.

It a bit like forcing a patient in intensive care to donate blood to stock up the blood bank in case the guy out on the street has an accident and needs a transfusion.

Offering a 20% negative equity guarantee( funded by our taxes) to anyone buying now at an already 70% reduction is blatant discrimination against those that bought at the peak.
 

killanigia

New Member
Myusername / Arthur - I am with you on this. I am a decent, hardworking guy who has lived frugally throughout, made 1 horribly bad investment and am now struggling to justify a monthly mortgage for the next 28 years for an overpriced property. I struggled for 3 years to make the decision to buy but eventually succumbed.
Now, the receivers have flogged off a host of apartments to a social housing agency funded by the State, the receivers will do anything to get rid of the incomplete buildings (and let the State pick up the tab), the last complete block will be flogged off (with a guarantee against negative equity - funded by the State).
I think your proposal is sound. In terms of BSQ, I'd be keen to put this on an agenda for the next Residents Committee meeting. I wonder whether the residents could club together for legal advice on the matter. 500 owners paying €500 would be a sizeable legal advisory budget to work with.
 

myusername

New Member
Killanigia, it would be great if your residents committee could include our proposals in the discussions with all owners in your development.

If we can get more and more neighbourhoods to take the same approach to our common problems, our ideas will eventually gain enough weight for a Government/Banks/NAMA response on this, because we are being completely forgotten.

Also, RTE is currently making a documentary on Negative Equity, they are looking to talk to people in our situation, this is a unique opportunity to make all our issues heard.

The person who is doing the research is Niamh Maher Office Number is 016468226 and email address is niamh@animo.ie.
 

2can

New Member
To reassure people, my thesis is not solely about the Leasing Initiative. I am investigating the potential issues which this solution to the oversupply will have on all stakeholders; developers, residents, council social housing, local authorities, department for housing etc. For this I need to speak with a resident. I can make it very brief and as simple as possible, to the interviewees suitability. Any volunteers?

Personally, I am skeptical of the social leasing idea, in particular, the Beacon South Quarter and Cluid plans. However, in order to reach a conclusion where I can propose alternatives or alterations to the Social Housing Leasing Initiative, I need to speak with residence. I would greatly appreciate any help.

To repeat, I am a postgraduate planning student at University College London. I am from Clonskeagh.
 
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